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Author Topic: Site: Announcement: Credit List  (Read 12249 times)

RHDNBot

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Site: Announcement: Credit List
« on: June 19, 2012, 04:54:45 pm »
Update By: Nightcrawler

Today we're making an announcement about a new Credit List feature we deployed recently on the site. It has been several years in the making. It was originally an idea from Satsu on how to better facilitate proper crediting of people in our database. There were many technical hurdles to overcome at the time. Allowing multiple author selection was a good stop-gap solution over nothing, but it still fell very short.

Let's say Aeon Genesis just released a new translation. That's great, but just who was under that umbrella for this release? Who did the stellar job translating that script? Who did the programming? What about that guy who made that custom decompressor utility? There are many important people involved in our hacking projects that deserve formal community recognition. Simply cramming all those names in the author list is not an elegant solution at all.

A credit list is not a difficult concept, but it can be very difficult to try to shoehorn into a database with roots dating back many years, containing a haphazard mix of people and groups, and entries assigned in various different ways. How do you do this without having to reset all entries, or lose all of our existing valuable associations? It was not an easy question and it took a long time to implement a viable solution.

We finally came up with something that works after some additional input from Spinner 8. All existing data and associations are preserved, and we have added the ability to properly fix and credit any entries going forward. Both old and corrected entries will operate. It is unlikely that all old entries will ever be corrected, so it is imperative that both old and new work.

The current 'Author' field for hacks and translations will be used as the 'Released By' field in all entry and search pages. In the case of a group project, only the group name should go here. All people belonging to a group for that project shall go to the Credit List. In the case of an individual project, only the primary individual/s to be credited for the release belong. All others involved should be added to the new Credit List attached to the entry. Additional information can be found on the Credit List submission page, and you may see the following examples for reference:


Relevant Link: (http://www.romhacking.net)

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Re: Site: Annoucement: Credit List
« Reply #1 on: June 19, 2012, 11:35:06 pm »
Hurray! It's nice to see everybody get their due in a public place. It used to not matter *as much* back in the day when everybody was strictly divided up into translation groups.

I'm probably going to slowly go over a lot of the old translation projects and add credit lists in, unless someone else had plans. I put in hours and hours of work and research on (wraith)'s and my planned Whirlpool revival a couple years ago, and eventually I had a full list of credits for about 95% of what was out there (as of February). It seems like a waste not to put it all somewhere.

edit: actually, forget "slowly"... since it's all stored on Parodius, I should probably get to work on that soon.

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Re: Site: Annoucement: Credit List
« Reply #2 on: June 20, 2012, 01:43:40 am »
Well, I just flooded the staff log with credits (in no particular order) for all my translations, at least to the best of my memory. ;D

I see I can't select myself. But I guess the purpose of the credits list isn't to list what the "releasing author" has done, but what the "contributing" authors have done?
Not sure if it is meant to credit individuals separate of group names? Just one example, I selected "Video Smash Excellent", even though ShihTzu is probably better known by his name rather than his site name?

I have at least one translation where a contributor preferred an "anonymous" name. Is it preferred to add that alternate ID, or to omit from the credits list?
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DarknessSavior

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Re: Site: Annoucement: Credit List
« Reply #3 on: June 20, 2012, 01:53:53 am »
Does this feature mean that you can now search for work done by "x author" and see all of the work they've done, much like the people behind the patches? I ask because once this database is more complete, it would help with my translation portfolio a lot, as I do a lot of translations for people on the Script Help board, and don't wind up remembering all of them... >_>

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LostTemplar

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Re: Site: Annoucement: Credit List
« Reply #4 on: June 20, 2012, 06:22:45 am »
That's pretty neat. It's nice to see that RHDN keeps evolving.

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Re: Site: Annoucement: Credit List
« Reply #5 on: June 20, 2012, 07:09:49 am »
It's great that the translators in the community will get a much needed spotlight from this. It sometimes tends to look like they're hiding in the shadows, while no project would be possible without them. And of course all the other people that are involved in a project will also get their due credit. Of course the readme files of the various projects (hopefully) list all of them, but how many people read and remember those? They deserve to be noticed right on the site.
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Re: Site: Annoucement: Credit List
« Reply #6 on: June 20, 2012, 09:56:42 am »
Can we submit Credits lists for translations or hacks that we didn't work on? Given some time, adding credits lists for all the translations should be very doable, in my opinion.

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Re: Site: Annoucement: Credit List
« Reply #7 on: June 20, 2012, 10:18:05 am »
KingMike:
You can't select yourself because you are not in the community database (Even if you were, you'd need to be marked as a person and not a group to show up for credit lists). You'd have to write yourself in for one list and get that approved. Then you'd be selectable for all subsequent credit submissions.

The credit list is intended to credit all individuals that contributed to the project (within the guidelines). So, you absolutely should add KingMike to all credit lists for projects released by 'KingMike's Translations'. The way the site is set up now for this is there are 'Releases' and there are 'Credit Contributions'. The site will differentiate between the two. See DarknessSavior's profile. He has both releases and credit contributions.

After you've converted all your translations, you should then associate your forum profile with 'KingMike' the person and NOT 'KingMike's Translations' the group. I still need to modify forum profiles to reflect credit contributions, but that is what should be done. In the end, we have clear differentiation between KingMike's Translations the group, it's releases, the people involved (including yourself), and their contributions.

Somewhat related, you should then update your Utilities and Documents to be from KingMike the person and not KingMike's Translations. That way all the work you have done will be assigned to the person KingMike. I know it's a lot to take in, but it has to be done like this to preserve the last 10 years of associations, allow for proper corrections, and work for both in the likely interim period (Until the day comes where all entries were corrected. Might be months, years, or even never).

As for the 'anonymous' guy. Either credit him for who he is, or omit. Adding multiple additional aliases for anonymity defeats the purpose of the credit lists and our site associations.


DarknessSavior
Yes. Exactly as such. You'd still search the community database. See your profile now. It will list your releases and credit contributions. Credited individuals will be on equal standing on the site with patch releasers.


Translators:

Under this new system, you should be in the credit lists. I know many of you had previously added yourself as a multiple author. For group releases, you should be removed and only the group name remains, and then add yourself to the credit list. In the event of an individual release, it's OK to have a release from two or more individuals when no group name exists, if you choose. You'd then be listed twice, once for the release, and once in the credit list for your contribution. I think we want to avoid having a release that is mixed from both people and groups, although the option is technical allowed if you had some good case for doing so.

I know it is a pain to potentially have to edit the translation entry and the credit list, but there's just no other way for old and new to all seamlessly continue working and maintain all associations. The reality is it is unlikely that all old entries will ever be corrected, and even if they are, it will take a long time. We need all things to work during that time and account for everything. :)
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Re: Site: Annoucement: Credit List
« Reply #8 on: June 20, 2012, 01:34:19 pm »
Awesome! This is a great way for keeping track and properly crediting all the people involved in a hacking/translation project. This feature is a nice addition to the site. :thumbsup:

By the way, one quick question. If a person took on multiple tasks in a project (such as hacking and translation or whatever else), should they be added twice (or how many else times) in the credits or only once for their most significant role?
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Re: Site: Annoucement: Credit List
« Reply #9 on: June 20, 2012, 01:51:55 pm »
Can we submit Credits lists for translations or hacks that we didn't work on? Given some time, adding credits lists for all the translations should be very doable, in my opinion.

Absolutely. :)

By the way, one quick question. If a person took on multiple tasks in a project (such as hacking and translation or whatever else), should they be added twice (or how many else times) in the credits or only once for their most significant role?

Good question. We don't have an official policy on this yet. I think I did approve one earlier that listed Chris Covell twice. Here is is. Once for graphics and once for text translation. However, perhaps it makes more sense to list only once per project? The issues is how do you combine two things like that in a single credit? What if you did everything yourself? Do you credit yourself in every category? That seems a bit silly.*shrug*

Any thoughts on this? We should figure out an official ruling on this before we get too many submissions.
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DarknessSavior

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Re: Site: Annoucement: Credit List
« Reply #10 on: June 20, 2012, 03:06:03 pm »
This is a great development. :D

As far as multiple roles on one project goes, shouldn't it be something like "Chris Covel. Graphics, translation." I mean, no matter what way you do this, it has the potential for clutter. If someone does four things, it creates four entries on the table. If you do it my way, there's potential to break the table? But I doubt anyone would do more than maybe two or three things on a project.

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Mauron

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Re: Site: Annoucement: Credit List
« Reply #11 on: June 20, 2012, 03:10:41 pm »
I agree with DS, with the specific note after the category. Chris Covell: Graphics (Title Screen), translation.
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Re: Site: Annoucement: Credit List
« Reply #12 on: June 20, 2012, 03:26:32 pm »
You're forgetting about the 'Type of contribution', which is selected via drop down. That's currently single selection only. We have a type of contribution, which is basically a category and then the more specific write-in, which some people may or may not use. Take a look at the submission form (you can use the [EDIT] link for that credit list) to see what we're talking about.
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Re: Site: Annoucement: Credit List
« Reply #13 on: June 20, 2012, 03:44:21 pm »
I think for the type of contribution only the most important category should be picked, with additional tasks being listed in the free text field. It's IMO the cleanest way. Hacking and Translation trump misc. tasks, if you are editing your own entries, pick freely what you feel is most important to you. The free text field will always clear up the specifics.

Having multiple categories selected or multiple entries for a single person just sounds like a mess.
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DarknessSavior

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Re: Site: Annoucement: Credit List
« Reply #14 on: June 20, 2012, 03:59:00 pm »
I think for the type of contribution only the most important category should be picked, with additional tasks being listed in the free text field. It's IMO the cleanest way. Hacking and Translation trump misc. tasks, if you are editing your own entries, pick freely what you feel is most important to you. The free text field will always clear up the specifics.

Having multiple categories selected or multiple entries for a single person just sounds like a mess.
That still doesn't clear up the situations where someone does both Hacking and Translation. I guess we could have an option for both, though?

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KingMike

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Re: Site: Annoucement: Credit List
« Reply #15 on: June 20, 2012, 05:51:16 pm »
Probably should, though I think we've only had a few people who can fit that description (at least for English translations). :)
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Mauron

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Re: Site: Annoucement: Credit List
« Reply #16 on: June 20, 2012, 06:37:53 pm »
You're forgetting about the 'Type of contribution', which is selected via drop down. That's currently single selection only. We have a type of contribution, which is basically a category and then the more specific write-in, which some people may or may not use. Take a look at the submission form (you can use the [EDIT] link for that credit list) to see what we're talking about.

Depending on how that information is stored, you may still be able to get the display I suggested.
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Re: Site: Annoucement: Credit List
« Reply #17 on: June 20, 2012, 08:58:49 pm »
Great idea! One thing that should be added as a contribution type and that is "Other". Why? What if a contribution doesn't fit in any other category?
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Re: Site: Annoucement: Credit List
« Reply #18 on: June 20, 2012, 10:45:12 pm »
Whoops, seems I messed up BRPXQZME's name while adding the credits to one of my translations. Might want to delete the wrong one. Don't want to have faulty credits now do we!?

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Re: Site: Annoucement: Credit List
« Reply #19 on: June 21, 2012, 03:16:11 am »
I’m used to it. It takes misspelling my real name (which is not that hard to spell, just highly unusual) to annoy me.

Also, there are four n’s in announcement. :D
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